Login Register

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1   [ 11 posts ]   
Author Message
 Post subject: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:03 am 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
The Angels were told of God's plan, some disagreed others went with him to eternal life in heaven.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 3:32 pm 
Offline
Journeyman
Journeyman

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:04 pm
Posts: 810
Location: Arkansas Ozarks
Religion: Catholic
Church Affiliations: 4th KofC
Have you got a cite for that?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 4:58 pm 
Offline
Handmaids of the Lord
Handmaids of the Lord
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:47 am
Posts: 8558
Religion: Catholic
Church Affiliations: Third Order Lay Carmelite
stephenandrewmaher wrote:
The Angels were told of God's plan, some disagreed others went with him to eternal life in heaven.


That doesn't sound quite right. This is what I was taught by my pastor many years ago when I was a little girl....I believe it was from St. Thomas Aquinas.

The angels were shown that one day the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity was to become a man...to save mankind. One third of them disagreed that this should be. Pride caused them to fall away. (They were made to see at a glance the reason for this). I am sure I am not saying this perfectly right as I have never gone to Catholic schools.

Perhaps someone can say it better!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 9:04 pm 
Offline
Jedi Master
Jedi Master
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 83146
Location: 1.5532386636 radians
Religion: Catholic
Church Affiliations: 4th Degree KofC
There's no settled doctrine on the point, but I think each of you is saying the same thing in a different way.

_________________
Nos autem in nomine Domini Dei nostri

Need something to read?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2022 5:02 am 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
To free the angels that fell, Gods plan was to create man, flesh on earth and Jesus as God in the eternal flesh became human flesh and destroyed death forever. The angels had an eternal soul and a choice. But without flesh and good works, they were not able to restore friendship or atone for their sin, thus making man greater than the angels in heaven. Man as flesh also had a choice and an eternal soul like the angels, but flesh made them greater than the angels in heaven. Flesh allowed salvation through sacrifice and good works to return eternal life for flesh and soul.

Peace always,
StePhen


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:06 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 9:23 am
Posts: 19624
Location: NYC area
Religion: Catholic
I don't know that I would ever go so far as to which is greater. Angels have their place in the divine economy and we have ours.

Scripture does say that we will judge angels, but I make no pretense as to what that might mean.
It also tells us in Ephesians that it is through the church that the principalities and authorities in heaven know of the wisdom of God. So if anything is greater than the angels, it would be the Church as a whole, and not us as individuals.

Last, St. Faustina said that the angels are 'jealous' of our ability to receive the Eucharist, and our ability to offer our sufferings to God.

_________________
A modern day Shunamite woman. (2 Kgs. 4:26)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2022 5:48 pm 
Offline
Jedi Master
Jedi Master
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2002 9:55 am
Posts: 83146
Location: 1.5532386636 radians
Religion: Catholic
Church Affiliations: 4th Degree KofC
Men are higher because our nature is joined to God's in the Hypostatic Union.

_________________
Nos autem in nomine Domini Dei nostri

Need something to read?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2022 11:43 pm 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
Last, St. Faustina said that the angels are 'jealous' of our ability to receive the Eucharist, and our ability to offer our sufferings to God.

Thanks for your addition on Saint Faustina'


"Saint Maria Faustina Kowalska was a humble instrument to the Lord, desiring religious life at only seven-years-old."


My thoughts are..
For without flesh the angels could not receive the Eucharist and without flesh they could not atone for sin. For infallible certainty that sins may be forgiven a firm commitment of amendment must be made. That along with confession of sin and punishment given for the crimes committed in the form of penance. This absolves the sin and restores friendship to the flesh and soul reunited with Jesus in heaven for eternal life. This is why 1/3 or some of the angels were jealous. It was God's plan to place man in heaven above the angels and have the angels be his' servants. The angels fall was they were created beings and are subject to judgement. They disagreed to Gods plan. But without flesh the angels could do no good works. Loss of friendship. The other 2/3 of the angels whom followed God's will are not in need of salvation and are already in heaven.


Peace always
Stephen


Last edited by StephenAndrewMaher on Fri Aug 26, 2022 5:49 am, edited 18 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2022 12:24 am 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
Based on the writings in the bible, If we truly believe in the Divinity of Jesus Christ, we then now understand that if everything were written, the world could not contain the books. So where do we go to get the answers? We go to The teaching church on earth, the Word which is The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. We know the priests and catch their words. Every Sunday the Mass reflects on the fact that Jesus is God and fulfillment of the old laws with the new covenant which is Eternal life, redemption life of the flesh, reunited with the soul and placed in Heaven. We understand all life, all holiness comes to God through Jesus Christ, and we continue to tell our brethren everywhere the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven are given to those, like Peter through his confession, who realize Jesus is God, and acknowledge everything he taught on earth and in heaven. Ra-affirm Christs' command when you were at the cross, where we became actual physical brothers and sisters of Christ and will share in the same eternal flesh. The same flesh Faustina saw in Poland in 1931 when she experienced a physical vision of Jesus who told her to paint a picture of him and have the words inscribed on it, "Jesus, I trust in you." and the same flesh Thomas saw in the upper room when he said, and gasping for breath, "My Lord and my God." Our nature is joined to God's in the Hypo-static Union in heaven with Him when Christ Jesus said to his mother, "Woman behold your son," and to the disciple, he spoke to you by name before you were born, He said, "Behold your mother." The unnamed disciple was you, Disciple! Keep Mary into your heart, with the church as your home and continue to pass on the fact to everyone that knowing and believing in the divinity of Jesus and understanding everything that he taught on earth SETS the heart in motion for something more than we can ever imagine. There is so much more. Heaven is real.

Peace always,
Stephen

Here is one of the promises of the Chaplet of Divine Mercy.

“Tell My priests that hardened sinners will repent on hearing their words when they speak about My unfathomable mercy, about the compassion I have for them in My Heart. To priests who proclaim and extol My mercy, I will give wondrous power; I will anoint their words and touch the hearts of those to whom they speak” (Diary, 1521).


Last edited by StephenAndrewMaher on Thu Dec 29, 2022 12:45 am, edited 28 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2022 12:53 am 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
Thanks Jedi Master

Peace always,
Stephen


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: God's plan is to place man in heaven above the angels.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2022 6:26 am 
Offline
Citizen
Citizen
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:42 am
Posts: 124
Location: Maine
Religion: Catholic
A question from Dorothy B.

"That doesn't sound quite right. This is what I was taught by my pastor many years ago when I was a little girl....I believe it was from St. Thomas Aquinas.

The angels were shown that one day the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity was to become a man...to save mankind. One third of them disagreed that this should be. Pride caused them to fall away. (They were made to see at a glance the reason for this). I am sure I am not saying this perfectly right as I have never gone to Catholic schools.

Perhaps someone can say it better!"

Great question, what about the Angels?
And Flesh will not only save mankind, but also 1/3 of the angels that fell who had not flesh to atone for sin.
Good works accomplished through flesh. We are the Handmaids of the Lord.
Man, with the keys to the kingdom now will save himself and the fallen angels, all through Jesus Christ.

Peace always,
Stephen


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1   [ 11 posts ]   


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 13 guests


Jump to:  
cron