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 Post subject: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:43 pm 
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Sirach was removed from the Bible by the arch-heretic Luther. It is not hard to see why he didn't like this Book since he was all about God's mercy and didn't seem to want to have any of God's justice or wrath. A lot of people are like that today. All you ever hear some priests talk about or write about is God's mercy, and you never hear about his Justice or wrath, as though those things are leftovers from the Dark Ages and we should therefore take them with the proverbial grain of salt, if not toss them aside altogether.

Well, here is a good passage about that:


Book of Sirach 5: 1 - 8



1 Do not set your heart on your wealth, nor say, "I have enough."
2 Do not follow your inclination and strength, walking according to the desires of your heart.
3 Do not say, "Who will have power over me?" for the Lord will surely punish you.
4 Do not say, "I sinned, and what happened to me?" for the Lord is slow to anger.
5 Do not be so confident of atonement that you add sin to sin.
6 Do not say, "His mercy is great, he will forgive the multitude of my sins," for both mercy and wrath are with him, and his anger rests on sinners.

7 Do not delay to turn to the Lord, nor postpone it from day to day; for suddenly the wrath of the Lord will go forth, and at the time of punishment you will perish.
8 Do not depend on dishonest wealth, for it will not benefit you in the day of calamity
.


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:34 pm 
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I think virtually all Americans presume on God's mercy and forget that he is absolutely JUST as well

Americans are spoiled

They seem to conflate freedom with license and etc...


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:19 pm 
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Luther did not remove Sirach or any other book from the Bible, he moved it to an appendix between the Old and New Testaments, but neither Lither nor any other Protestant ever removed it from the Bible. The Deuterocanon were not removed from ANY Bibles until the 19th century, 300 years after Luther, and even then, this was done only in the English speaking world. The Deuterocanon was part of Luther's Bible and is still included in modernized editions of Luther's Bible today.


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:14 pm 
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Doom wrote:
Luther did not remove Sirach or any other book from the Bible, he moved it to an appendix between the Old and New Testaments, but neither Lither nor any other Protestant ever removed it from the Bible. The Deuterocanon were not removed from ANY Bibles until the 19th century, 300 years after Luther, and even then, this was done only in the English speaking world. The Deuterocanon was part of Luther's Bible and is still included in modernized editions of Luther's Bible today.


In the 1928 Book of Common Prayer, oft used by the more traditional Anglicans in this country, that passage (and the 2 following verses) is the reading appointed for the OT Lesson for the 15th Sunday after Trinity. Memory says I was the Lector, that day last year.


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:12 am 
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AND...

“... when Luther first proclaimed his doctrine of sola scriptura… (and) sola fides… the Radicals* hailed him and for a while followed him. But when Luther proceeded to criticize certain writings within the canon as not sufficiently solafidest… many of the Radical Reformers balked and in the end most of them in the 16th century fell back upon the pre-Reformation canon in toto…”

Source. Page 817 of Chapter 32, The Bible in the Radical Reformation, in The Radical Reformation by George H. Williams (edition unknown)

*Anabaptists, Waldensians and Mennonites are noted as such in this chapter.


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:35 pm 
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Doom wrote:
Luther did not remove Sirach or any other book from the Bible, he moved it to an appendix between the Old and New Testaments, but neither Lither nor any other Protestant ever removed it from the Bible. The Deuterocanon were not removed from ANY Bibles until the 19th century, 300 years after Luther, and even then, this was done only in the English speaking world. The Deuterocanon was part of Luther's Bible and is still included in modernized editions of Luther's Bible today.

well, i guess some historians are liars

gee, how shocking

God knows which ones, the ones I have read or the ones you have, are telling the truth


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:46 pm 
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Some Poor Bibliophile
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flyingaway wrote:
Doom wrote:
Luther did not remove Sirach or any other book from the Bible, he moved it to an appendix between the Old and New Testaments, but neither Lither nor any other Protestant ever removed it from the Bible. The Deuterocanon were not removed from ANY Bibles until the 19th century, 300 years after Luther, and even then, this was done only in the English speaking world. The Deuterocanon was part of Luther's Bible and is still included in modernized editions of Luther's Bible today.

well, i guess some historians are liars

gee, how shocking

God knows which ones, the ones I have read or the ones you have, are telling the truth


Doom is correct.

On Bibles in general, Doom is usually correct.


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 Post subject: Re: the danger of presuming on God's mercy... Sirach 5
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 7:25 pm 
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King of Cool
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flyingaway wrote:
Doom wrote:
Luther did not remove Sirach or any other book from the Bible, he moved it to an appendix between the Old and New Testaments, but neither Lither nor any other Protestant ever removed it from the Bible. The Deuterocanon were not removed from ANY Bibles until the 19th century, 300 years after Luther, and even then, this was done only in the English speaking world. The Deuterocanon was part of Luther's Bible and is still included in modernized editions of Luther's Bible today.

well, i guess some historians are liars

gee, how shocking

God knows which ones, the ones I have read or the ones you have, are telling the truth



Or perhaps the problem is your lack of reading comprehension


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