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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:14 am 
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Doom wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
the Bible cannot make decisions.


More proof you are clueless........


The Bible can make decisions? Really? So if I ask it what I want to make for dinner it will tell me 'make a lasagna' just like Siri? Who knew?


If the Bible answers questions "just like Siri," we are all in deep kimchi come the afterlife....

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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:20 am 
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marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
the Bible cannot make decisions.


More proof you are clueless........


:nooo: Seriously dude, you need to rethink your strategy here.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:11 pm 
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Doom wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
the Bible cannot make decisions.


More proof you are clueless........


The Bible can make decisions? Really? So if I ask it what I want to make for dinner it will tell me 'make a lasagna' just like Siri? Who knew?


Judging from your post on here, I'm sure that's what you would ask if you had the chance.......

I will stick with this.........Hebrews 4:12

12 "For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:23 pm 
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marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
the Bible cannot make decisions.


More proof you are clueless........


The Bible can make decisions? Really? So if I ask it what I want to make for dinner it will tell me 'make a lasagna' just like Siri? Who knew?


Judging from your post on here, I'm sure that's what you would ask if you had the chance.......

I will stick with this.........Hebrews 4:12

12 "For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."


:roll:
13] And before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Thats before "Him", marc, not "it".

The Word of God is Jesus Christ, not a book. A Person, not a thing.

So again your ideas don't follow from scripture. You're worshiping the book, not the God it proclaims.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 7:16 pm 
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Mithrandir wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
the Bible cannot make decisions.


More proof you are clueless........


The Bible can make decisions? Really? So if I ask it what I want to make for dinner it will tell me 'make a lasagna' just like Siri? Who knew?


Judging from your post on here, I'm sure that's what you would ask if you had the chance.......

I will stick with this.........Hebrews 4:12

12 "For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."


:roll:
13] And before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Thats before "Him", marc, not "it".

The Word of God is Jesus Christ, not a book. A Person, not a thing.

So again your ideas don't follow from scripture. You're worshiping the book, not the God it proclaims.


The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture....but I figured you wouldn't get that either because it's obvious you haven't had any training in the study of scripture..........and that's not a cut down, it's just an observation..... :)


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 7:46 pm 
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marc wrote:
but I figured you wouldn't get that either because it's obvious you haven't had any training in the study of scripture..........and that's not a cut down, it's just an observation..... :)


While you're at it, why don't you try selling us some beachfront in Tennessee, or "affordable health care." :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:04 pm 
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marc wrote:
Mithrandir wrote:
marc wrote:
Doom wrote:
marc wrote:

More proof you are clueless........


The Bible can make decisions? Really? So if I ask it what I want to make for dinner it will tell me 'make a lasagna' just like Siri? Who knew?


Judging from your post on here, I'm sure that's what you would ask if you had the chance.......

I will stick with this.........Hebrews 4:12

12 "For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."


:roll:
13] And before him no creature is hidden, but all are open and laid bare to the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Thats before "Him", marc, not "it".

The Word of God is Jesus Christ, not a book. A Person, not a thing.

So again your ideas don't follow from scripture. You're worshiping the book, not the God it proclaims.


The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture....


Yes I know. Apparently you don't because textually you refuse to separate them according to the context. You're one of the bigger offenders against Scripture that I've witnessed.



marc wrote:
....but I figured you wouldn't get that either because it's obvious you haven't had any training in the study of scripture..........and that's not a cut down, it's just an observation..... :)


Whatever you say, "marc". I'm not the one ripping verses out of context as a pretext for strawmen arguments that don't even come close to saying whatever you try to make them say.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:17 pm 
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Mithrandir wrote:

Whatever you say, "marc". I'm not the one ripping verses out of context as a pretext for strawmen arguments that don't even come close to saying whatever you try to make them say.



I just simply quoted scripture, the fact that you don't hold scripture on the same level as I do is probably your biggest
problem...........


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:26 pm 
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marc wrote:
Mithrandir wrote:

Whatever you say, "marc". I'm not the one ripping verses out of context as a pretext for strawmen arguments that don't even come close to saying whatever you try to make them say.



I just simply quoted scripture, the fact that you don't hold scripture on the same level as I do is probably your biggest
problem...........



My my you do have an awfully high opinion of yourself don't you?


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:27 pm 
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marc wrote:
Mithrandir wrote:

Whatever you say, "marc". I'm not the one ripping verses out of context as a pretext for strawmen arguments that don't even come close to saying whatever you try to make them say.



I just simply quoted scripture,......


No you didn't. You cited Hebrews 11:3.

Then you used that verse to insist that an inanimate object-the Bible-can of its own accord make decisions just as people do.


marc wrote:
the fact that you don't hold scripture on the same level as I do is probably your biggest
problem...........


Oh, without a doubt I don't "hold scripture to the same level" as you do.

I don't place the "Bible"-meaning your rather imaginative and gross misinterpretation of the Bible-over and above God and His Church.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:38 pm 
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I've seen marc's kind of "quoting Scripture" many times before. He's the kind of person who will follow Matt. 27:5 with Luke 10:37b. Two very Biblical verses that, when taken out of context and pasted together like a hastily-constructed ransom note, create a meaning that God never intended. :nooo:


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:52 pm 
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marc wrote:
The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture


Please cite scripture verses that state "Word of God" means Scripture and the person of Jesus "in the scripture" alone.

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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:01 pm 
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I've seen atheists cite Romans 3:11-12 to insist that the Bible says all Christians are idiots and don't know the God they follow and Psalm 14:1 to insist that the Bible says that there is no God.

Anyone can rip any sentence or verse out of the Bible, and out of its context, to make it say whatever it is they want it to.

That is why sola scriptura is NOT in the Bible. That is why the Church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth.

Its why John in writing about him and his fellow bishops and presbyters in his first letter said this:
"6] We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error. (1 John 4:6)

He wrote this because there were those who had gone out from the Church and without his authority teaching that Jesus wasn't the Son of God.(1 John 2)

Again, context.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:09 pm 
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I don't know... its very hard to interpret the correct list of books that belong in the Bible from Bible verses alone.

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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:23 pm 
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Alexandros wrote:
marc wrote:
The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture


Please cite scripture verses that state "Word of God" means Scripture and the person of Jesus "in the scripture" alone.




John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (This is Jesus in the Flesh).

Hebrews 4:12
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. (This is scripture)...


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:52 pm 
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marc wrote:
Alexandros wrote:
marc wrote:
The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture


Please cite scripture verses that state "Word of God" means Scripture and the person of Jesus "in the scripture" alone.




John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (This is Jesus in the Flesh).

Hebrews 4:12
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. (This is scripture)...


No it does not because in the following verse (v. 13) it refers to the Word of God as "Him", not "it".

I've already pointed this out to you.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Mithrandir wrote:
marc wrote:
Alexandros wrote:
marc wrote:
The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture


Please cite scripture verses that state "Word of God" means Scripture and the person of Jesus "in the scripture" alone.




John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (This is Jesus in the Flesh).

Hebrews 4:12
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. (This is scripture)...


No it does not because in the following verse (v. 13) it refers to the Word of God as "Him", not "it".

I've already pointed this out to you.

    Hebrews 4:12-13
      12 Indeed, the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing until it divides soul from spirit, joints from marrow; it is able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. 13 And before him no creature is hidden, but all are naked and laid bare to the eyes of the one to whom we must render an account.

When the complete thought is considered, the "word of God" is in reference to Jesus Christ.

But even just considering Verse 12, we see "it" being able to know a person's thoughts and intentions and make a judgment of those. Written words on a page in a book on a shelf cannot do this. Only a sentient being and one with supernatural powers could know another's thoughts and intentions. When Verse 12 is coupled with Verse 13, there is no doubt that the reference is to Jesus Christ.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 6:51 pm 
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Mithrandir wrote:

No it does not because in the following verse (v. 13) it refers to the Word of God as "Him", not "it".

I've already pointed this out to you.


Hebrews 4.......
12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. 13 Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

Your Catholic Bible words it differently from this interpretation but they both mean the same thing.... and that is the "Him" you are referring to is God the Father, this is not speaking of Jesus........Verse 12 is speaking of scripture and verse 13 is speaking of God the Father..........

Surely there is someone on this board that can help this guy understand this? It's really simple Bible 101...........


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:51 pm 
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marc wrote:
Mithrandir wrote:

No it does not because in the following verse (v. 13) it refers to the Word of God as "Him", not "it".

I've already pointed this out to you.


Hebrews 4.......
12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. 13 Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

Your Catholic Bible words it differently from this interpretation...


1)My "Catholic" Bible is the Revised Standard Version-used by both Protestants and Catholics.

2) Even my King James version has the personal pronouns "Him" and "His" as this demonstrates:
"[12] For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
[13] Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do."

This has to do with Judgement. Again Scripture proves you wrong:
"[22] The Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son,"

The one thing it does NOT say is the very ridiculous thing that you are asserting: "That the Father has given all judgment to the Scripture."

You are in fact adding to the Scriptures.
:roll:

marc wrote:
but they both mean the same thing.... and that is the "Him" you are referring to is God the Father, this is not speaking of Jesus........Verse 12 is speaking of scripture and verse 13 is speaking of God the Father..........


No. You're wrong. The entire subject of the passage is "The Word of God"-Jesus. As evidenced by verse 14 and following:
"[14] Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.
[15] For we have not a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin.

marc wrote:

Surely there is someone on this board that can help this guy understand this? It's really simple Bible 101...........


The very facts and the nonsense you have continually presented on this forum are evidence to the contrary. You have persistently shown that you really have no idea what you are talking about.


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 Post subject: Re: A test for Sola Scripturists
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:51 am 
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marc wrote:
Alexandros wrote:
marc wrote:
The phrase "Word of God" is used for both the Bible and the person of Jesus in the scripture


Please cite scripture verses that state "Word of God" means Scripture and the person of Jesus "in the scripture" alone.




John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (This is Jesus in the Flesh).

Hebrews 4:12
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. (This is scripture)...


I don't see where it says in the Scripture alone, do you?

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