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 Post subject: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:28 pm 
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Colson, will be remembered as the tough-as-nails special counsel to President Richard Nixon who went to prison for his role in a Watergate-related case and became a Christian evangelical dedicated to helping inmates.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04 ... z1siUeIsol

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:52 pm 
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aussie_aussie_oi_oi wrote:
Colson, will be remembered as the tough-as-nails special counsel to President Richard Nixon who went to prison for his role in a Watergate-related case and became a Christian evangelical dedicated to helping inmates.l



Only if an extremely biased liberal writes the obituary....Colson tough as nails? Please...

Anyway, I liked him, sad to see him go.....


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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:53 pm 
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Doom wrote:
aussie_aussie_oi_oi wrote:
Colson, will be remembered as the tough-as-nails special counsel to President Richard Nixon who went to prison for his role in a Watergate-related case and became a Christian evangelical dedicated to helping inmates.l



Only if an extremely biased liberal writes the obituary....Colson tough as nails? Please...

Anyway, I liked him, sad to see him go.....



I think Magruder said something like that about him.

GKC

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:00 pm 
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GKC wrote:
Doom wrote:
aussie_aussie_oi_oi wrote:
Colson, will be remembered as the tough-as-nails special counsel to President Richard Nixon who went to prison for his role in a Watergate-related case and became a Christian evangelical dedicated to helping inmates.l



Only if an extremely biased liberal writes the obituary....Colson tough as nails? Please...

Anyway, I liked him, sad to see him go.....



I think Magruder said something like that about him.

GKC


Well, the famous thing that was said about Colson was in an editorial in the Wall Street Journal, it said ''Charles Colson would walk over his own grandmother to get Nixon elected'.....Colson thought that was hilarious (especially since all his grandparents were dead) and he said, tongue in cheek that 'I would walk over my own grandmother to get Nixon elected'.....and even though it should have been obvious that he was being facetious, it stuck. But the truth is that he was no more 'tough' or 'ruthless' than any other political adviser tends to be.

But when Watergate happened, Colson ended up not putting up much of a fight, pleading guilty to something he didn't do (and which wasn't even illegal in the first place, a fact frequently ridiculed by G Gordon Liddy)....some tough guy. If he was half as tough and ruthless as his reputation he would have fought the charges and never gone to prison in the first place.


Last edited by Doom on Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:02 pm 
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Met him when he and my father spoke at the same event. He was a nice man.

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:10 pm 
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Doom wrote:
GKC wrote:
Doom wrote:
aussie_aussie_oi_oi wrote:
Colson, will be remembered as the tough-as-nails special counsel to President Richard Nixon who went to prison for his role in a Watergate-related case and became a Christian evangelical dedicated to helping inmates.l



Only if an extremely biased liberal writes the obituary....Colson tough as nails? Please...

Anyway, I liked him, sad to see him go.....



I think Magruder said something like that about him.

GKC


Well, the famous thing that was said about Colson was in an editorial in the Wall Street Journal, it said ''Charles Colson would walk over his own grandmother to get Nixon elected'.....Colson thought that was hilarious (especially since all his grandparents were dead) and he said, tongue in cheek that 'I would walk over my own grandmother to get Nixon elected'.....and even though it should have been obvious that he was being facetious, it stuck. But the truth is that he was no more 'tough' or 'ruthless' than any other political adviser tends to be.

But when Watergate happened, Colson ended up not putting up much of a fight, pleading guilty to something he didn't do (and which wasn't even illegal in the first place, a fact frequently ridiculed by G Gordon Liddy)....some tough guy. If he was half as tough and ruthless as his reputation he would have fought the charges and never gone to prison in the first place.


He said he plead guilty to start his life change.

GKC

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:14 pm 
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GKC wrote:
He said he plead guilty to start his life change.

GKC


I assume he was following the advice of his lawyer, who may have been worried that worse charges were coming down the pike later as the scandal was uncovered....but my point is if his reputation for 'ruthlessness' was true he wouldn't have done it.

That being said, Watergate sure seems like a big pile of nothing compared to the political scandals of today.....Fast and Furious or Watergate, which is more troubling? Not Watergate, that's for sure. Nixon looks squeaky clean compared to some of his successors.


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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:18 pm 
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Doom wrote:
GKC wrote:
He said he plead guilty to start his life change.

GKC


I assume he was following the advice of his lawyer, who may have been worried that worse charges were coming down the pike later as the scandal was uncovered....but my point is if his reputation for 'ruthlessness' was true he wouldn't have done it.

That being said, Watergate sure seems like a big pile of nothing compared to the political scandals of today.....Fast and Furious or Watergate, which is more troubling? Not Watergate, that's for sure. Nixon looks squeaky clean compared to some of his successors.




IIRC, he said his lawyer was agin it.

Bit it was long ago.

GKC

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 10:53 pm 
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GKC wrote:
Doom wrote:
GKC wrote:
He said he plead guilty to start his life change.

GKC


I assume he was following the advice of his lawyer, who may have been worried that worse charges were coming down the pike later as the scandal was uncovered....but my point is if his reputation for 'ruthlessness' was true he wouldn't have done it.

That being said, Watergate sure seems like a big pile of nothing compared to the political scandals of today.....Fast and Furious or Watergate, which is more troubling? Not Watergate, that's for sure. Nixon looks squeaky clean compared to some of his successors.




IIRC, he said his lawyer was agin it.

Bit it was long ago.

GKC


I looked it up and you're right, his lawyer was against it because the trial was going his way and it looked like the judge was going to dismiss all the charges.....which is definitely not the time to offer to plead guilty to a lesser charge.


I don't know...it doesn't make sense, maybe he just felt that he needed to plead guilty and serve time so he could clear his conscience...


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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:35 pm 
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As I've heard the story (I think on GetReligion) he refused to plea bargain to charges of which he was not guilty but told the prosecutor he was guilty of obstruction of justice and would plead guilty to that if they charged him with it, which they did. Which is a pretty remarkable story.

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:30 pm 
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Max Kolbe wrote:
As I've heard the story (I think on GetReligion) he refused to plea bargain to charges of which he was not guilty but told the prosecutor he was guilty of obstruction of justice and would plead guilty to that if they charged him with it, which they did. Which is a pretty remarkable story.


His decision to plead guilty was controversial at the time because it was widely believed that he was on the brink of being completely acquitted. Liberals complained that the guilty plea must have been the result of pressure because Colson must have had damaging evidence against Nixon and that Nixon was intimidating Colson into silence. According to Rowan, the guilty plea was suspicious because 'the judge was making noise about dismissing all the charges'.

And even then, Colson's conviction is still regarded by many as an example of prosecutors blowing minor things out of proportion and abusing their power in their zeal to 'get Nixon'. In the words of Victor Lasky, Colson went to prison because 'he decided to plead guilty to something he didn't do, and which wasn't even illegal in the first place.'


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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:12 pm 
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Could be. I was able to track down the original interview from a few years back where I had first read the story as Colson tells it. It's here.

Here's his version of things:

Chuck Colson wrote:
Question: If Watergate didn't prompt your conversion, do you feel that your conversion affected how you handled Watergate?

Oh, yes. One day I did a show with Mike Wallace. This was when Watergate was absolutely at a fever pitch and the trials were going to begin and by this time I'd been indicted. He asked me how I could be a friend of Richard Nixon, given the things Nixon had said on the tapes. And I said, "Well, he's my friend and I don't turn my back on my friend."

I got home that night and realized that there was no way I could be a good witness for Christ if I compromised on what I could say, or was not as fully honest as I could be. So I decided the best thing I could do was plead guilty. I sent my lawyers into the Watergate prosecutors to say I wouldn't plea bargain, and that I had not done what they charged me with [conspiracy to cover up the Watergate burglary], but here was something I had done [obstruction of justice] — and if they wanted to charge me with that, I would plead guilty. And I did.

It's a very interesting interview all the way around, and I remember at the time having a deepened respect for him after I read it.

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:22 pm 
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Well that seems to confirm what I speculated about earlier, that the reason he decided to plead guilty was because he felt like he had to 'clear his conscience' by confessing and getting the prison term over with. But I do find it interesting that, even though he was willing to admit that he wasn't fully ethical in his behavior while employed by the Nixon White House, he STILL would not admit to the central accusation of the Watergate scandal, namely that there was a conspiracy to cover up the Watergate break in. That's the one thing that is consistent about everyone who was part of the Watergate scandal, all of them from Nixon on down, Haldeman, Elichmann, Mitchell, MacGruder, Liddy and Colson all of them denied that there was a conspiracy to cover up the break in. They all denied it literally to their dying day (of course Liddy is still alive as of today), they were willing to admit to literally everything else...but not that one thing. It seems such a minor point to refuse to concede, especially when they are willing to admit to literally everything else. Unless of course, they genuinely believe that they didn't do anything wrong in that particular instance.


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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:27 am 
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That is odd.

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:42 pm 
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:pray:

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 Post subject: Re: Chuck Colson RIP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:30 pm 
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Chuck's autistic grandson Max always watches the Divine Mercy Chaplet on EWTN: http://thedivinemercy.org/news/story.php?NID=4277

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