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 Post subject: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:24 pm 
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Master
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but not just the two of us...he also wants our three-member "council" to meet with us so we can discuss the "transition," that is, my leaving in September. I have declined to do that. It feels like an ambush.

We are taking a vacation in July (no girls' clubs), so I have only August left, and if I work it right, I can teach without error. I think we'll do "Puppets." That seems safe.

However, I have not heard back from the pastor since I told him I would not meet with him and the council. I would not be surprised if he tells me it's ok if I leave now. We'll see.


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:28 pm 
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Handmaids of the Lord
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Prayers for you.
:pray: :pray:

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:32 pm 
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I guess my question is this: how do you rate your apologetic abilities if you get cornered?


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:39 pm 
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:pray:

Good decision, in my opinion.

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:40 pm 
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:pray:


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:49 pm 
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:pray:


I agree that this was a good decision.

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:53 pm 
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Wise decision. Praying you can make a clean break soon and come back home.

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:20 pm 
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Light of the East wrote:
I guess my question is this: how do you rate your apologetic abilities if you get cornered?


Image

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:29 pm 
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He probably wants to try to talk you out of it, and I'm sure he won't tell you haven't already heard a million times

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:33 pm 
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Light of the East wrote:
I guess my question is this: how do you rate your apologetic abilities if you get cornered?

I know a lot about a few things. ::): I can hold my own on those few things, but frankly I'm going to try to avoid very much discussion. I'm just too young to be able to say very much yet, KWIM?


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:36 pm 
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Doom wrote:
He probably wants to try to talk you out of it, and I'm sure he won't tell you haven't already heard a million times

Yes, I'm sure that's what he wants, too.

Bless his heart...he's only been pastor at this church since June 13. What a welcoming committee I've been. ::):


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 12:19 am 
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Good instincts. :pray:

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 3:31 am 
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Sounds like a Mt. 18 ambush, indeed. :pray:

:fyi: I sidestepped any ambushes at church by going quietly, but was forced into one with HR at work.
Part of the doctrinal part of it went like this:
Me: Catholics don't believe what many Protestants think they believe. Most Catholic beliefs are found in some form of Protestantism. What doctrines are problematic?
HR: [rattles off the long, usual list, ending in 'confession to a man']
Me: Well, I can't address all of those, I didn't really come prepared for all that, but let's talk about confession since you mentioned that last. Do you have a Bible handy?
HR: [says yes and hands me one]
Me: [Goes to John 20, while asking]It's not really in the Bible, where in the Bible do you get the idea that confession ought to be in prayer?
HR: Well, there's not a verse, you're right.
Me: [hands Bible back open to passage]Would you read verses 21 to 23?
HR: "Again Jesus said, 'Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.' And with that he breathed on them and said, 'Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.'"
Me: Why would Jesus give his disciples power to forgive sins, after his resurrection, if they weren't supposed to do it? And how were they to know sins if they weren't confessed? You have no verse other than an indirect Psalm - which poetically speaks of confessing to God in prayer. What do you think?
HR: [hems and haws]
Me: All of Catholic teaching is Biblical, in cases like this, more Biblical than Protestant tradition. What's the biggest problem with me becoming Catholic? If you had to pick one issue, what would it be?
HR: Salvation, it would be the false gospel.
Me: Salvation? Do you know what Catholics teach about salvation? It's nothing that some form of Protestantism doesn't accept.
HR: Okay, what do Catholics believe about salvation?
Me: Well, we believe we are saved by grace alone [cut off]
HR: No you don't.
Me: Yes, we do.
HR: No you don't.
Me: Perhaps you are confused since we can't be Supralapsarians?
HR: Well, you don't believe in grace.
Me: I've studied it, and can produce official church documents that that's what we believe, what are your sources?
HR: I've studied it too, and you don't.
Me: Perhaps you are confusing it with faith alone, since we don't believe in [cut off]
HR: No, you don't believe in grace alone.
Me: Yes, we do.
HR: No you don't.
Me: I can send you official [cut off]
HR: You might genuinely think they do, but that's not what Catholics believe.
Me: We do, and always have.
HR: No you don't.
Me: I can see this is not going to get anywhere, may I email them to you later today?

It turned out HR's sources for official Church doctrine were John MacArthur's blog ramblings. I emailed the sources but got a "let's drop this since we don't care" response.

Anyway, now you have vicariously 'enjoyed' the experience. Hope it was fun!
:)

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ἄξιος εἶ, ὁ κύριος καὶ ὁ θεὸς ἡμῶν, λαβεῖν τὴν δόξαν καὶ τὴν τιμὴν καὶ τὴν δύναμιν, ὅτι σὺ ἔκτισας τὰ πάντα, καὶ διὰ τὸ θέλημά σου ἦσαν καὶ ἐκτίσθησαν. Ἀποκάλυψις 4:11


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 6:31 am 
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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:42 am 
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My Baptist Chaplain tried to talk me out of converting...in Iraq

As we got into the discussion he somehow wandered into...

"...the Bible says, 'this is my Body, this is my Blood'...well, you know, figuratively...

I just looked at him...but I was thinking...It doesn't say FIGURATIVELY...and smiled...

Thank you for playing, have a nice day!


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:04 am 
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I agree, they say the same stuff over and over. I'll never forget back in my 'soul searching' days, I was attending a Baptist church, and my very first Bible class was predicated on anti-catholic teaching--so much negative attention about Roman Catholisim was being shoveled out, with the tired old "it's not scriptural" rubbish. It only made me want to study Catholicism more and more. I'm so glad to be home.


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:15 am 
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I guess I am fortunate because I never really got any resistance, the only 'church' I was ivolved in at the time was the Campus Crusade for Christ....and all I had was about a 5 minute 'talk' and when I made it clear my mind was made up I was told 'well....at least you are going to be 'churched' somewhere...that's the important thing'

I faced no real hostility or resistance.

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:13 pm 
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My DH's Presbyterian session put me on trial (!) because they wouldn't just remove my name from their rolls. I had to appear before them and give account for myself. This happened the night before I came into the Church. They declared me to be a heretic, apostate and "turned me over to Satan." Yeah. It's all in their minutes. These six men, including one man who makes his living as a Greek scholar, were shocked that a little housewife would stand up to them and tell them that they were wrong!

Good times.

DH can never serve on session of a PCA church because his wife is "not in line." :shock:

I'd avoid that little meeting like the plague, Mea.


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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:14 pm 
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Why bother showing up for that? If they refuse to remove your name from their membership rolls, that's their problem.

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 Post subject: Re: So, the pastor wants to meet with me...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:15 pm 
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Jeanne D'arc wrote:
My DH's Presbyterian session put me on trial (!) because they wouldn't just remove my name from their rolls. I had to appear before them and give account for myself. This happened the night before I came into the Church. They declared me to be a heretic, apostate and "turned me over to Satan." Yeah. It's all in their minutes. These six men, including one man who makes his living as a Greek scholar, were shocked that a little housewife would stand up to them and tell them that they were wrong!

Wow! :shock:


Good job to you! :D :clap: :clap:

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Quid retribuam Domino pro omnibus quæ retribuit mihi?

"Take it as a certain sign that your charity is not genuine if your words, no matter how true, are not charitable." --St Francis de Sales

"The thing is--to be ready to die: and is there one of us who would quite like to die, doing as little for God as we are doing now?" --Fr Faber


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