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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:37 pm 
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Heretic!

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:39 pm 
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Obi-Wan Kenobi wrote:
Heretic!


:huh

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:48 pm 
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You gave the wrong response to "nm"! That's wrong! Even gherkin-wrong!

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:05 pm 
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The best analogy for trinity is three people controling one robot. And one of them also control a car (which is Christ's human nature).

All other analogy pale in comparison.


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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:22 pm 
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:roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:39 pm 
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Can we add robot analogies to the list of anathemas, or, at minimum, make citing them a bannable offense?

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:50 pm 
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Are you familiar with the school of thought which holds that the staff-to-snake transitions of Pharoah's magicians were possible because the staffs were really vegetable robot snakes? Sad to say, I am not making this up, though the "school" may have only one member, who used to post here.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:09 pm 
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I am not familiar with that school of thought (as it dawns on me that both terms in that little turn of phrase are highly debatable in this application). I wonder what drives a person to draw conclusions that are so obviously absurd -- that's a general question. I've seen people do this sort of thing on a many issues, as I know you have, too. My favorite personal example was the guy I spent about two hours with discussion the historical evidence for the resurrection of Jesus and who concluded, in light of the evidence, that obviously aliens came and stole Jesus' body and then impersonated Him for the next month of so. He was being completely serious and was sober.

So it sounds like I can add your name to the petition to ban robot references? 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:17 pm 
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It would have been better if he'd said that it was a robot impersonating Jesus. A robot under alien control would have been fine. As a matter of fact, aliens were somewhere in that theory too, though I forget exactly where.

You wouldn't want to ban Gort, would you?

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:54 pm 
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Gort should be banned for being named "Gort." Unless He is a robot, in which case, he should be banned for not having a better human-he-is-impersonating name.

However, if he were to stylize it as theGort, well, perhaps we could make an exception. On the condition he never proposes robot analogies.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:19 am 
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theJack wrote:
Gort should be banned for being named "Gort." Unless He is a robot, in which case, he should be banned for not having a better human-he-is-impersonating name.

However, if he were to stylize it as theGort, well, perhaps we could make an exception. On the condition he never proposes robot analogies.


You're banned for never having seen The Day The Earth Stood Still. Anyone who's seen that movie should have immediately gotten Father Kenobi's reference.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:41 am 
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I saw the Keanu Reeves remake. It piqued my interest enough that I've been meaning to watch the original, but haven't gotten to it yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:32 pm 
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theJack wrote:
I saw the Keanu Reeves remake. It piqued my interest enough that I've been meaning to watch the original, but haven't gotten to it yet.



And, for more fun, read the origin short story, "Farewell to the Master"/ Harry Bates. It's online. You can learn Gort's real name.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:32 pm 
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theJack wrote:
Can we add robot analogies to the list of anathemas, or, at minimum, make citing them a bannable offense?


Sure. But you'll also be anathemizing all other analogy, like St. Patrick's three leaves clover, because all other are way inferior than my robot analogy. It's simply the best. Fruit of hours of musing.


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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:05 am 
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beng wrote:
theJack wrote:
Can we add robot analogies to the list of anathemas, or, at minimum, make citing them a bannable offense?


Sure. But you'll also be anathemizing all other analogy, like St. Patrick's three leaves clover, because all other are way inferior than my robot analogy. It's simply the best. Fruit of hours of musing.
St. Patrick's analogy is also problematic.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:59 am 
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beng wrote:
theJack wrote:
Can we add robot analogies to the list of anathemas, or, at minimum, make citing them a bannable offense?


Sure. But you'll also be anathemizing all other analogy, like three leaves clover analogy attributed to St. Patrick, because all other are way inferior than my robot analogy.


FTFY

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:32 pm 
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I haven't really heard of a good analogy. I suppose the psychological analogy of St. Augustine is pretty good, but otherwise, I can't think of a good analogy.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:09 am 
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ThomisticCajunAggie wrote:
I haven't really heard of a good analogy. I suppose the psychological analogy of St. Augustine is pretty good, but otherwise, I can't think of a good analogy.

God is, by nature, absolutely other than us. Beyond the philosophical truth of that, it's bluntly stated in Scripture: "There is none like You, O LORD; You are great, and great is Your name in might" (Jer 10:6). Anyway, however we establish the principle of the absolute uniqueness of God, one accepted, it seems we should immediately stop looking for analogies, since analogies necessarily work by comparison. And if God's own essence is incomparable, how much more His unity in diversity of persons, which is even more incomparable?

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:13 am 
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Eph 3:14-15 suggests that analogies can be drawn between human things and divine. For that matter, the very names of the Persons and the idea of generation with respect to the Son also have earthly analogues. The problem with analogies for the Trinity is that they are almost (entirely?) more confusing than helpful.

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 Post subject: Re: Trinity question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:50 am 
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I respectfully disagree with the first sentence. I agree with the second, but I don't think that's particularly helpful. On that count, the Bible talks about God in a great many analogies -- He is our rock, He hides us under His wings, He gets angry and loves and repents and knows things and sits on a throne and all the rest. But the problem with using that to argue for analogies for the Trinity is that none of our Trinitarian analogies are anthropomorphisms, nor could they be. And even if they could be, they'd be wrong, insofar as humans are not a Trinity (no matter how much my tripartite believing brethren want to claim). So I think that is why analogies aren't helpful and cause more confusion. By their very nature, in my assessment, they are trying to do what in principle cannot be done: compare something metaphysically infinite and absolutely simple (and compoundedly so!) with something finite and highly complex. The necessary, unavoidable result will be to import error, no matter what aspect of truth we're trying to hint at. Again, in my opinion and my assessment. I encourage others to defer to you (said with all sincerity, by the way).

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