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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 8:16 am 
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the qur'an teaches that when JESUS comes back he WILL APOLOGIZE TO ALLAH FOR THOSE WHO CLAIM HIS DEITY....

it teaches that those who believe in JESUS and dont deny his deity are "enemies" to allah and should be put to death....


after learning of CHRIST---take up a qur'an and learn the truth of this hateful idiotic religion.....

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:03 am 
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jay wrote:
I would most certainly say Jews do not worship the true God. Christ is God in person, and to deny that is to deny who God is. They do not know who God is, they do not know God.


So it is your premise that a Jew in 34 BC knew and worshipped God, but Jew in AD 34 did not?


If someone reads the OT only, and comes to belief in the God revealed in the OT, is that the same God Christians worship?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:16 am 
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Brendan wrote:
jay wrote:
I would most certainly say Jews do not worship the true God. Christ is God in person, and to deny that is to deny who God is. They do not know who God is, they do not know God.


So it is your premise that a Jew in 34 BC knew and worshipped God, but Jew in AD 34 did not?


If someone reads the OT only, and comes to belief in the God revealed in the OT, is that the same God Christians worship?


And if you wish to follow this line of thinking, Mark (and I'll leave you to do so), than I don't think there is any doubt that the God you worship is not the same God that the apostles worshipped since you deny so much of what He revealed.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:20 am 
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Spootz wrote:
I thought about this too but realize Christian and Jews worship the same God but yes, Jews "perception" is different. However, Islam's Allah is totally different because of it's roots in paganism.


I'm not sure that is correct, spootz. Islam can in some sense lay claim to the same 'roots' that Christianity does or Judaism. I think Islam is instead a result of following the Arian heresy to the 'next level'.

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Joe Mizzi by-the-way is a former Catholic and I wouldn't say he's anti-catholic. Believe me I've experienced anti-catholicism but don't sense this from him on his website.


I remember visiting this guy's website one time. The only thing I remember about it was that it contained a lot of errors and misinterpretations - as many such protesting sites do.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 8:50 am 
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Brendan wrote:
jay wrote:
I would most certainly say Jews do not worship the true God. Christ is God in person, and to deny that is to deny who God is. They do not know who God is, they do not know God.


So it is your premise that a Jew in 34 BC knew and worshipped God, but Jew in AD 34 did not?


If someone reads the OT only, and comes to belief in the God revealed in the OT, is that the same God Christians worship?


there are some evidences of false premises in your post---not YOUR premises, but ones your post revealed...

remember this one thing---TRUE FAITH is always in CHRIST.

read hebrews 11---verse 1 tells us exactly what faith is---and then goes about giving EXAMPLES OF FAITH IN THE OLD TESTAMENT.

after reading ALL HEBREWS 11, one concludes that ABRAHAM KNEW THE TRUE GOD---AND THAT MEANS HE KNEW CHRIST.

at the "transfiguration"----who was there?

2 OLD TESTAMENT PROPHETS---moses and elijah-----THEY KNEW CHRIST.

your question---" a jew in 34 b.c vs a jew in 34 a.d---

what nationality and faith did the 12 apostles belong to?----JEWS

**they lived "before" the ministry/revealing of MESSIAH,
**"during" the ministry/revealing of MESSIAH,
**and "after" the ministry/revealing of MESSIAH------they had experience on BOTH SIDES----if you will.

AND SO DO WE----we are not born saved---WE HAVE TO come to a saving knowledge of CHRIST---just as they did.......

if a jew HAD TRUE FAITH in 34 b.c----HE WAS JUSTIFIED....
if a jew DIDNT---he was lost---and the pharisees and scribes are perfect examples of these.....

NOT ALL JEWS ARE LOST-----just because they are jews.

JESUS IS A JEW!!!!!---

a jew in 34 A.d without true faith is LOST, the same way a gentile is lost---no different.


your 2nd question---if someone reads ONLY the old testament---can they be saved----the answer is YES!!!

the jewish word for the 1st five books of the bible--TORAH-- means "revelation"----

and WHO DOES THE OLD TESTAMENT REVEAL---

EVERY SINGLE PASSAGE LEADS DIRECTLY TO CALVARY---JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD.....

HE is the 'SPIRIT' of all prophesy
HE is the AUTHOR of all scripture
HE is the REASON God SO LOVES THE WORLD........

if ADAM, knew GOD---
if NOAH,knw GOD---
if ABRAHAM, knew GOD---
if MOSES, knew GOD----


anyone with TRUE FAITH can be led thru only the O.T.---but when they eventually read the NT----they will really know who CHRIST IS----something that OT SAINTS DIDNT HAVE----they had FAITH IN THE PROMISE OF CHRIST---

and MOSES saw CHRIST at the burning bush
ABRAHAM saw CHRIST at his offering of ISAAC

etc.....

JESUS IS God THE SON---HE IS ETERNAL---ONE GOD---3 PERSONS---ETERNAL.

where the FATHER IS--so is THE SON and the HOLY SPIRIT----they are "divided" but not "separated"........

not 3 GODS---ONE.

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1 cor 15:57
But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


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