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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:10 pm 
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MichaelD14 wrote:
Frankly, why would it matter if a certain theologian was named or directly disciplined?

So the faithful are not led astray by their errors. What good is it, if artificial contraception is condemned, if those who dissent from that teaching are never sanctioned and allowed to spread their views? If a priest is sanctioned for dissenting from Humanae Vitae, and the sanctions are subsequently lifted without the public abjuration of his views, what message does that send to the faithful?

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:43 pm 
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Peregrinator wrote:
MichaelD14 wrote:
Frankly, why would it matter if a certain theologian was named or directly disciplined?

So the faithful are not led astray by their errors. What good is it, if artificial contraception is condemned, if those who dissent from that teaching are never sanctioned and allowed to spread their views? If a priest is sanctioned for dissenting from Humanae Vitae, and the sanctions are subsequently lifted without the public abjuration of his views, what message does that send to the faithful?


If an error is condemned properly the dissenters are left on the fringe.

For example, the US politicians that promote abortion are not understood as the faithful. Regardless of the ones who claim they are devout. Abortion is a clear intrinsic evil. If a Bishop {by omission} may give one the impression a dissenting politician is faithful - or the same by being involved in a funeral Liturgy of a dissenting politician - that’s on their heads...the faithful are still required to be adults in the faith.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 7:12 am 
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MichaelD14 wrote:
...the faithful are still required to be adults in the faith.

I'm not sure you're taking the sheep..shepherd language seriously enough here. The faithful are not expected to be theologians, and if they're consistently being fed bad theology through preaching or praxis, they're pretty darn likely to absorb it.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:49 am 
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I have to say, one of my least-favorites memes is the one about loving the Catholic Church because it treats us like adults.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:50 am 
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MichaelD14 wrote:
the faithful are still required to be adults in the faith.

Our Lord says we should be like little children.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 11:55 am 
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Peregrinator wrote:
MichaelD14 wrote:
the faithful are still required to be adults in the faith.


Our Lord says we should be like little children.


Yes - in that Children trust their parent. That's what God wants, out trust in Him. Which is not easy.

This is from Cardinal Ratzinger in 2005:

Quote:
Let us reflect on two points. The first is the path to the “maturity of Christ,” as it states, simplifying the text in Italian. More concretely, we would have to speak, according to the Greek text, of the “measure of the fullness of Christ,” which we are called to attain to truly be adults in the faith. We should not remain as children in the faith, in the state of minors. And what does it mean to be children in the faith? St. Paul answers: It means to be “tossed to and from and carried about with every wind of doctrine” (Ephesians 4:14). A very timely description!

How many winds of doctrine we have known in these last decades, how many ideological currents, how many fashions of thought? The small boat of thought of many Christians has often remained agitated by the waves, tossed from one extreme to the other: from Marxism to liberalism, to libertinism; from collectivism to radical individualism; from atheism to a vague religious mysticism; from agnosticism to syncretism, etc.

Every day new sects are born and we see realized what St. Paul says on the deception of men, on the cunning that tends to lead into error (cf. Ephesians 4:14). To have a clear faith, according to the creed of the Church, is often labeled as fundamentalism. While relativism, that is, allowing oneself to be carried about with every wind of “doctrine,” seems to be the only attitude that is fashionable. A dictatorship of relativism is being constituted that recognizes nothing as absolute and which only leaves the “I” and its whims as the ultimate measure.

We have another measure: the Son of God, true man. He is the measure of true humanism. “Adult” is not a faith that follows the waves in fashion and the latest novelty. Adult and mature is a faith profoundly rooted in friendship with Christ. This friendship opens us to all that is good and gives us the measure to discern between what is true and what is false, between deceit and truth.

We must mature in this adult faith; we must lead the flock of Christ to this faith. And this faith, the only faith, creates unity and takes place in charity. St. Paul offers us a beautiful phrase, in opposition to the continual ups and downs of those who are like children tossed by the waves, to bring about truth in charity, as fundamental formula of Christian existence. Truth and charity coincide in Christ. In the measure that we come close to Christ, also in our life, truth and charity are fused. Charity without truth would be blind; truth without charity would be like “a clanging cymbal” (1 Corinthians 13:1).

[url=
https://zenit.org/articles/cardinal-rat ... -conclave/]Cardinal Ratzinger’s Homily before 2005 Conclave [/url]

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:31 pm 
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MichaelD14 wrote:
Peregrinator wrote:
MichaelD14 wrote:
the faithful are still required to be adults in the faith.


Our Lord says we should be like little children.


Yes - in that Children trust their parent. That's what God wants, out trust in Him. Which is not easy.

We should trust in God, and in the shepherds he sends us. Which is precisely why the chief shepherd on earth and his appointed helpers--and our own local shepherds, our bishops--have such a grave obligation to discipline the wolves masquerading as shepherds.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2017 11:34 am 
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Nathan wrote:
Who are some amazing Catholic Scripture Scholars that are still living today, preferably in the USA?

Please don't say Scott Hahn. Not that he's bad, it's just, everybody always suggest Scott Hahn- I am aware of him.


My experience is that they all rely on ancient sources, but my current favorites are Dr. Brant Pitre and Dr. John Bergsma.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 8:39 pm 
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Nathan Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 1:00 pm
It's the explosion in Lay apologetics after VII and especially in recent decades that makes it seem like the Magisterium has left it to the Laity to fend for themselves.

APOLOGETICS. The science that aims to explain and justify religious doctrine. It shows the reasonableness of such doctrine in the face of the objections offered by those who refuse to accept any religion, especially Christianity and more particularly Roman Catholicism. Also called fundamental theology as the science that establishes the credibility of Christian revelation on the evidence of miraculous phenomena and the testimony of unbiased history. (Etym. Greek apologetikos, a defense.)
Modern Catholic Dictionary by Fr. John A. Hardon, S.J.
http://www.therealpresence.org/cgi-bin/getdefinition.pl

No way has “the Magisterium left it to the Laity to fend for themselves.” That too many bishops and priests may now fail to inculcate this teaching reflects human failure which is always present. It is up to you to search and find.

As Doom has pointed out Veritatis Splendor and Evangelium Vitae contain great teaching.
You could examine The Encyclicals of Pope John Paul II at CUF, from the Mar/Apr 2006 Issue of Lay Witness Magazine at http://www.cuf.org/2006/06/faith-fact-t ... n-paul-ii/

Some are: Redemptoris Mater; Ad tuendam fidem; Laborem Exercens; Sollicitudo Rei Socialis; Centesimus Annus; Fides et Ratio; Ut Unum Sint.


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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 3:53 pm 
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Thomist wrote:

No way has “the Magisterium left it to the Laity to fend for themselves.” That too many bishops and priests may now fail to inculcate this teaching reflects human failure which is always present. It is up to you to search and find.



What?

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 3:55 pm 
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anawim wrote:
Nathan wrote:
Dr. Brant Pitre and Dr. John Bergsma.


Been listening to Brant after Obi's suggestion, very impressive.

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 Post subject: Re: Catholic Scripture Scholars
PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 4:48 pm 
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Quote:
Nathan Posted: Sat May 20, 2017 7:53 am
Thomist wrote:
No way has “the Magisterium left it to the Laity to fend for themselves.” That too many bishops and priests may now fail to inculcate this teaching reflects human failure which is always present. It is up to you to search and find.

What?


See: Thomist Posted: Fri May 19, 2017 12:39 pm


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